Majority opposes auto bailout, poll shows

The banks, the auto industry, and how many more institutions that plan to jump on the bandwagon, they all need to stop expecting handouts from the government and either sink or swim. The people are the ones that need the help the most right now, mostly because of the shifty deals that have been offered to them by the mortgage companies, banks and the Big 3. I need help but I don't see the government throwing money at me, I am on disability and can barely make ends meet. SSD gives me 875.00 a month. I do not feel sorry for any of them.

The banks ask for money, now the big 3 wants money. Where does it stop I ask you?? I was talking with someone the other day and what he said made some since. Why not give every America worker who has paid taxes $100,000.00 each. Now what do you think these people would do with that kind of money, buy house, buy a car, pay off a credit card or two, maybe even put some of it into bank for a rainney day. Now you can say you jummped started America again without making the fat cat any fatter, and help the people and our country at the same time. It's time to remove those whom make poor jugdement for major company's and giving them the easy way out. Anyway as a tax payer we are paying for it anyway, why should it not be ours ?

Although I don't like bailing them out, I fear that their employees will be condemned to a fate similar to those in steel producing areas like Northwest Indiana. Once US steel died, the area never recovered and it has been depressed ever since.   

It appears the problem here is people don't realize what the true outcome would be if anyone of the big 3 are to close their doors or go bankrupt. It wont just effect Detroit or the automakers plants, this problem will snowball down. Even further then those who appose a bailout can imagine. The government helped bailout the banks to get them out of their problems they have caused. But if they don't help assist the automakers through these hard times, helping the banks will just turn up to be a senseless act of lending money. Long story short, if the big 3 go bankrupt who will buy their vehicles? And with no one or very few people buying their vehicles they have to close plants. By closing the plants they inadvertently shrink the rest of the work force tied into their operations. Starting with the General Manager right down to the UPS person that delivers packages to that building. That UPS worker doesn't even work for an automaker, but you see where this could go? For every person they lay off it would have a ripple effect right back to the banks. I'm sure there is more then one person that the big 3 would have to lay off that has a house they would loose to foreclosure. So many people are so quick to say don't bail them out. We'll my question then is who wants to bail the banks out a second time?

Airlines have gone bankrupt, did the earth stand still?

There are things that most people don't understand.  If the
auto industry is not helped, the consequences to our economy
would be dire.   More of your tax dollars will be needed if they
are allowed to go under.  Don't think of it as "so much of your
money now" as it being "a hell of a lot more later".  The cash now
can hopefully avert something far more expensive for tax payers.

Auto industries around the world are being supported by their
governments.  If we loose the ability to manufacture automobiles,
it could hurt national security if we need to produce vehicles in a
war situation.  We can not loose the ability to build things in this
country.  Our economic house of cards built on bravado has proven
the need for an economy built on quality products that are not
based on hot air.  In basic terms, if this loan is not extended, there
will be no turning back to correct the oversight.

This downturn all started when predatory loans skyrocketed since
Bernanke's fear of inflation caused him to raise interest rates.  Now
there's a threat of deflation which is much worse.   We must help the
car industry, help those trapped by the mortgage industry and allow
our nation to rebuild.   Even those not in trouble can refinance at the
lower rates so try to think about your country and not just yourself.

To Bank Bailout is Going to Fail:

None of your points matter at all.  And I don't even believe you are right.  Let the Big 2.5 fail, and let them lay off whomever they will.  Let the effect "trickle down".  It doesn't matter.  America needs a severe recession in order to purge the system of its failures.  Or don't you believe in evolution, the survival of the fittest?  These things must take place in order to make us strong and fit again.  Why prolong the inevitable?  Perhaps you are one of the weak, and you might not survive.  No matter what, evolution must prevail, and you must pay the price.  Actually, all these blogs prove that evolution is not true because when it is our ox getting gored, we want none of it.  However, the recession will come, whether you want it or not, and no government bailouts can prevent the inevitable.

It can prevent a global depression that would devastate everyone !

Above Average Citizen....Correct!

The automakers had their chances to upgrade with the times, they chose not to. the Government ALLOWED our valuable resources to be shipped over seas. 

We created the cars and now don't know how to make affordable cost effective ones anymore?...The Unions have ruined employment too.

You are so correct they do need to be purged and started anew.

People still need cars that are quality made and not the crap the big 3 have been turning out.   Maybe they could sale a few dozen corporate jets and ease up on those multi-million dollar bonus packages that they give them selves. 

We already bailed out Chrysler once.  Remember those Chrysler "K" car crap that they used to make. 

We bailed out the banks because they were in the mess that they were in due to GOVERMENT regulations that forced them to give out loans to people with poor credit.

To compare the two bailouts is like apples and oranges.

If the BIG 3 get bailed out by the good ole U.S.A. what is in it for the taxpayer that is footing the bill??  Do we all get $30 dollar an hour jobs with the additional $30 dollar an hour benefits package??  Better cars and trucks?  How about owner discounts!!  Sale them at cost to keep the BIG 3 open.  No more huge profit margins.

I have worked in the automotive industry for the past 14 years.  Design Engineer / Sales / Finance.  It can not be disputed that there has been a lot of greed and waste (we see it on Wall Street and in Politics everyday).  It was reflected in the products that the Detroit 3 produced in the past.   I agree that there needs to be restructuring and trimming of "fat".  However, I believe if the Detroit3 fail it will extend the ever growing gap between the rich and the poor.  Eliminating a group of consumers that help drive our national economy.  Not just employees at Chrysler/Ford/GM, but the vast global supply base and local private businesses that provide services.

I am not looking for a handout, just some relief to allow us the opportunity to restructure.  And the time to get the safest fuel efficient vehicles on the show room floor.

Personally, I pay into Social Security and I do not plan on seeing that when I retire.  I took on a house that I could afford and a 30 year fixed mortgage.  I am making my house payment presently and don't complain about the value of my home dropping 25%.  Yet my house payment reflects the purchase price from 4 years ago and the ever increasing property tax rate.  I try to save money away in my 401k.  But I don't have any recourse for the thousands of dollars that I lost over the last 6 months.  I accept that I will never be able to retire, so enjoy your job and work hard.

I look at the investments in and the donations to our country/ local community that the Detroit3 have made.  If they wanted to say, "Give me all of that back".  There would probably be outrage over that topic.  Everyone at some point is down and in need.  This is not a bailout, but a loan. 

America is the land of second chances.  If we are extended this loan and with a stabilization of our economy, we will regain the consumer confidence with the products we are bringing to market.

The auto and oil industries over the years have purchased many patents that would bring financial savings to people world wide and greatly reduce the effects of global warming.  It's not a conspiracy theory...it's a fact.   Now as far as Detroit is concerned, like many of you...I work for a meager wage as a contractor for the Federal Government...$15.99/hr and I'm finding it hard to swallow the idea that my children and I will have to pay more in taxes to bail these goons out.  The same goes for UAW...where the average worker nets approximately $78.00/hr to stand there and watch or guide machines that do most of the work for them.  It is time we stand up and tell our Congressmen/women to say no to this bail-out and force these companies into Bankruptcy Court...as many of us had to do personally.   After they restructure...then  give them a stimulus package on the caveat that it must be repaid in full.   If the UAW is unwilling to renegotiate...then to hell with them as it is time they realize that their workers have it better than most Americans who are relegated to working at McDonald's or Burger King for a mere $5.45/hr.   Greed is the prime motivating factor and for the really rich it is power backed with money...so while Americans still have a say in what happens with this country I think it's time to make our voices heard. 

    The bank bail out was not supported by the majority either and our lawmakers did it anyway. There is a significant difference between purchasing bad assets from the banking sector and loaning money to the manufacturing sector. The monies sent to the banking sector was a true giveaway or bailout. The failures in both of these industries were a direct result of poor buisness decisions and practice but the same exact failures are also happening within our government and we the pepole continue to re elect the same group. Like it or not we have no choice but to help manufacturing out in the short term. The effects of not doing it would be catostrophic to our economy and it certainly makes a lot more sense then the give away that happened for the banking sector. If we really want to change the direction our country is going then we need to stop supporting the corrupt two party political system and the people who are associated with it.

Rick, I understand what you are saying, but what happens if they don't recover? How will the loan be repaid then? I think the executives of the Big 3 need to give of themselves, since it has been stated that GREED, played a major role in the downfall. I feel for the families that depend on the jobs. as I was laid off 3 times in one year, but I feel like it is time for those who make the money and waste it to give back what they took!

My prayers are with the families. They are the real victims here. They are the ones who will suffer.

Where do you draw the line for these bailouts? I don't have the answers, but I know that if I have a financial problem, borrowing to fix it, is not often the right answer. Anybody out there know the answer, cause I am curious.

unconvinced failure would hurt the economy.

How badly have our government officials stained their own credibility that a majority of people don't think the failure of GM, Chrysler, and Ford will hurt the economy. I could not imagine the warzone the streets of Detroit would turn into if these three blinked out of existence. Has anyone seen Robocop?

To the earlier comment by jlcamplin: I too would like to see some sort of stimulus money given to taxpayers.  However, it would take 15 trillion dollars to give the estimated 150 million tax payers $100,000 each.

How can so many people be so ignorant when it comes to the Auto Industry and how it will effect the entire country.  Is it because they only listen to the Media?  If you were too look at how The Big 3 have so much to do with our Nation you would think twice before speaking.  Do you realize that the Big 3 are taking this as a loan to be paid back?  That this is not FREE money as so many of you have posted.  Its not, if you were to look back in history, when Chrysler had financial problems so many years ago, it took a loan from the Government. Keyword here people, loan.  It was ALL paid back.  Which one of these financial institutions will be paying back the government even a portion of the billions of dollars they were GIVEN? Not one.  The Big 3 are inter-twined into EVERY aspect of this economy. The car dealerships that are in each of your towns that employ mechanics, receptionists, sales persons - or how about the IT people at Microsoft that thier technology is used in the Ford Vehicles?  What about the Steal?  How about the tire manufacturers?  Do you people not see what the Big 3 do for you?  They are in SO many states - Alabama, Texas, Missouri, they use GE, sourcing companies.  The cell phone companies for their employees, (which contracts will be diminished), which leads to the technicians - the big three utilized SO many companies - Why can't you look outside of just Michigan, look at they aren't just in Michigan.  They are connected to you.  So, watch.  If these companies are not LOANED any money, watch how much further this country is going to fall.  You think you have it bad now, just wait...And please before listening just to the media do a little research to find out more details and information..

Christian Grandma:

They have already borrowed themselves to the hilt. Now they are facing not being able to pay their parts suppliers or anyone else they owe money to (at least in the case of GM.) GM and Chrysler need a loan to get themselves to, last I heard, March. Then they will be back in this position. But by that time they should have their debts and their union contracts restructured to allow them to be viable. At least that's the claim.

Spend 1.5 trillion. I could do quite a bit with 10 grand.

It is my opinion that most people that disagree with the auto LOAN is that they are between 20 and 50 years of age. This generation has never had to really want for anything because their parents always provided for them when they were young. I don't think they ever had to eat flour and water pancakes  three times a day because of a failing economy. During the 1940's and 50's times were hard and people had to depend on each other. Now it's a dog eat dog world and with the attitude of what can you GIVE me ; ie, YOU OWE ME because my parents always gave to me. Now it's time to give back and you don't know how. Spend a little time in Iraq and then come home to appreciate what you have. By not allowing the loan it will meltdown (cause a depression) like it has never before been seen. A lot of just flour and water pancakes. Wake up and defend your country Americans>

It is about time that all politicians realize that We the People place them in power through voting and it is We the People that pay taxes and lay down our lives in war time. ANY plan to spend our tax dollars should be approved by We the People. Politicians work for us and we are their ultimate bosses.

We are living in an era, the Internet era, where hierachical power structures are no longer necesary. We can now operate with horizontal government strutures instead of the vertical and corrupt system we have today. We the people should be able to vote on issues into minute details. An example of how the Internet has modified news media to the point where newspapers are a thing of the past, they are going under. News media does not even choose which newsworthy items are broadcast to us. We choose what we want to watch. The same should now be done to government. No longer do we need representatives to vote for us. Each American now has a Soc.Sec. number and we should be able to vote ourselves at the most detailed levels utilizing the Internet. Once instituted, such a form of government will do away with corruption.

I beleive that the Big 3 are responsible for their dilema due to poor decisions, top heavy higharchy management styles that have continued for far too long. In all of my dealings with the Big 3, primarily GM I have also found them to be top heavy with far too many chiefs focusing on their own empire vs. what is the best for the organization and the supply base. All have been resistant to internal change over the years and have always protected the good ole boys club... Now that they are faced with the possibility of financial destruction they have decided to wake up and make changes.... I am not in agreement with hand outs for organizations that cannot manage a business, however the failure of this industry will devistate communities and in some cases entire cities... the local coffee shop, diners, clothing stores, dentists ect.... you name it and it will be impacted..... I read that in the southern states government officials do not feel that it will impact them.... how wrong could that be? These people that work in colder climates will not be heading south anytime soon and therefore not spending money..... So although I agree that a bailout must happen, I don't think it will help long term unless the mentality of the big 3 will change... I have spent the majority of my working career conducting company turn arounds, sell off and closures and the first place I have always started is at the top and worked down and everyone aside from a select few I have dealt with at the big 3, think that they are the all mighty and what they say and do is gospel.... Maybe they need to step back and take a good hard look in the mirror and ask themselves if they owned this business would they have allowed the higharchy, private jets, golf memberships, large bonuses from an under performing company or the high archy that has taken so many years to build.... It will crumble over night and allot of Americans, Canadians and private business owners will find themselves in the same financial trouble as the big 3... The big 3 needs to receive help and have someone with intestinal fortitude force the change needed to turn it around. Instead of Plant managers being rated on how many non saleable vehicles they push through a facility... rate them on how they manage cost and profit for each facility.... maybe then they will be forced to remove the empires they have built around them.   

I feel better now.....            

To Jim756944,

Times have changed just a little bit and so have the markets and their demands. Our auto markets are saturated and our World is crying to stop pollution and oil dependence. The car industry model has run its course.

Personally I believe in something called the dark night of the soul which causes deep introspection so that a new conscience revolution can takes place. Maybe a depression would be good for the American innovative powers to come forward and create a new paradigm for evolution to occur. A bailout may just be like enabling a drug user to continue using and simply delay any rehabilitation.

Soooo... the airlines were allowed to go bankrupt after 9-11 and no one thought twice about that??  How is this different - the airlines ran themselves into the ground with poor management just like the Big 3 is doing to themselves. 

People can be as mad as they want to be about the "foreign" automakers but the bottom line is this - they wouldn't be popular if their cars weren't built better.  5 years ago I gave up on the "American" car because I just couldn't afford to buy a car and spend THOUSANDS in repairs before the care flipped 100K miles.   The "Big 3" got caught up in the theory people want to get a new car every few years and didn't pay attention to those of us who wanted a car that would last.  But let's be honest - people wanted a new car every few years because the cars they bought were crap.

The UAW was created solely for the purpose of protecting the employees at the factories because management didn't care about them.  Nothing has changed other than the employees now have another management (UAW's) that don't care about them either and they get to pay for that privilege.  The unreasonable demands (job banks anyone?) and the auto makers willingness to pay for it is one of many reasons they are where they are now. 

So the bottom line is, just like the banking industry, the taxpayers of today and future generations will be paying for the short term greed and pilfering by management of both the UAW and automakers, past and present.

Bankruptcy doesn't mean they will close their doors - it only "forces" them to get their act together and I say it's about time. 

As for pensions - puhleeze - show me a company TODAY that has kept their end of the bargain in terms of paying out pensions of employees who worked decades for them with the promise that they'll be taken care of.  Really - show me one.  Union or non-union.  Half of my family members who are retired are union and they too are getting the shaft these days.

Airlines have gone bankrupt, did the earth stand still?

It did in the new Tom Cruise movie.

Hey -- how about they give us cerfiticate that we can use to get one of them cars?? Give people the cars for the money we give them!!!

The joke is we didn't buy their <junk> cars, so they are going to just TAKE OUR MONEY!!! We should get something for that. The union boys have some pretty darn good severance packages I'd bet.

Anyway, if we give them money, we should get the cars.

since when does bankrupcy mean closing the doors?

Toyota and GM sold the same number of cars world wide, Toyota made a nice profit while GM is standing in line for a hand out.  Hmmmmm, how can this be?

Loaning $40B money to the Auto Industry is a far better use of taxpayers money then giving $700B (and growing daily) to Wall Street and far better than the trillion dollars spent on Iraq.

First off I want to know who supposedly voted in this poll. Yes its ridiculous that the banks wanted a huge bailout and now the auto industry does too, but being a Michigan worker and knowing first hand how Myself and others, especially those that work in small factories that help the auto industry are being affected its ahrd to say no. Especially because if they dont pull some money out their ass soon or get the bailout there are going to be a @!$%# ton more people unemployed. And honestly we don't need anymore of that. Theres already a huge shortage of jobs as it is right now, people loosing their homes, barely eing able to afford food to feed their family. Something needs to be done and soon!

The people did not want the banks to get bailed out either but that happened.

The Big 3 not happening is political because they don't have the power that the bankers do. In any event, our congress quit working for us a LONG time ago...

It's becoming more and more aparent that the money we used to 'bail out' the banks has simply been stolen.  Okay, we the people got screwed -- what a surprise.  Now...  Even though the auto 'bailout' is only about one percent the size of the bank's incompetency reward, just giving it to the scumbag CEOs and the UAW, and then trusting them to restructure, will just result in a little delay in the ineveitable.  It's like loaning money to your alcoholic brother-in-law, an enabler.  The only way the big three will change their ways is in bankrupcy.  They don't close their doors and go away, they just have a grown-up make sure they behave.  Given past performance, mandatory third party oversight is the only way they'll restructure.

If a majority of Americans are opposed to the bail-out, Congress is sure to pass it. Bank bail-out, case in point.  I am opposed to all bail-outs. However, if a bail-out is to be had, it needs to go through the consumer/taxpayer. If you want to stimulate the economy the consumer is the place to put the money. If you want to create jobs, public works is where to put the money. I prefer nuclear power plants myself. You can not accomplish either, job creation or stimulate the economy, by giving money to people or corporations that may not even spend it or it is already gone. If the banks need money, we need to increase interest rates. Yes, it would hurt on the borrowing side but that make the increase in funds in the bank two-fold. Less people borrowing and increased savings.

It is both managements and the UAW's fault. During the years of huge profits, "The Big Three" never developed smaller, fuel efficient vehicles (management), nor did they invest in newer more effiecient facilities (management), automation-yes, facilities-no. Very odd how the Japanese and Korean automotive companies are buildig new facilities here in the USA. Also, lets not forget the strikes that were imposed by the UAW and the current decision by the UAW for wage concessions. The Big Three will never be competitive if they are paying for the retirees benefits and the high wages of the union employees. And yes, if The Big Three go down, it will have a massive effect on the economy. It will not only be The Big Three, but also all the suppliers that work with them, and there are a high number of suppliers. Let this swirl around in your heads a bit:

Request for a government managed benefit program for the current retirees. Sucks, I know. Our taxes will pay for it, but we will have to pay taxes anyway at some point.

Give the benefit amount accrued by the current employees for retirement, and require them to roll it all over into 401k (can you even imagine how much money would be pumped into the economy). Also, require the current employees to start contributing to their own 401k.

Remove current management and replace them with innovative personnel to develop new process/vehicles. Well, Ford is not quite dead yet, so Mulally can stay, for now.

Remove the Union, and never to return, ever. It is time.

Mark - auto workers do not make $78/hr. That figure includes taxes, benefits for that employee and legacy costs of the retired worforce.

The US mfgs are doing well overseas. Google Chevy UK. You will see models that get up to 65 mpg on clean diesel.

The CEOs, Union leaders and our federal government are all responsible for the state of the auto industry.

I don't understand the refusal to cut pay and the Democrat's refusal to ask them too. To me it is simple: do they want a job with lower pay, or no job at all?  I would think the answer would be obvious. No concessions, no bailout

Rich,  I MIGHT go along with a Bailout, IF, You get rid of the Unions,  And EVERYONE takes at LEAST a Fifty percent cut in pay.  And that means EVERYONE. CEO right down to the Janitor. And get rid of existing CEOs.  And don't give me that Bullsh-- about not being able to afford your house or to retire ever, Which house?  The one you live in, or your Cabin, or your retirement Home in Fla.?

The middle class was created by the car industry. Henry Ford paid workers enough to purchase the complicated machines they produced. That was a first in world history. While I will agree there is a need to restructure, bankruptcy wont work. Comparing the manufacture of a concrete asset to purchasing a one use airline ticket is a joke. I need to know someone will be around to fix my car for the next ten plus years, not two weeks until I use my ticket. My Oldsmobile is 17 years old and has 150K+ miles and we drive it daily. I can still get it fixed. GM does not own the jets they fly on. They are leased from a service. Getting rid of the service will cost money. Have you ever tried to get out of a lease early? The UAW has ridiculously high compensation. Perhaps the problem we need to address is the Union, not the manufacturer hamstrung by the Union contract. I am amazed by the lack of intelligence I see here. Emotional sound bites are not a good way to make decisions. Our economy will COLLAPSE if the three automakers declare bankruptcy. Period. Wake up and look at the long term.

  All the People who oppose the Auto bailout are just Jelous, because they don't have a good job like the Auto workers do...   It was the Government that created this mess in the first place, they allowed the banks to do those kind of loans, and tied the hands of the States that were trying to stop the banks, saying that Federal laws overpower State laws ( this was a report on MSN ) The head of that Federal Dept. now works as Lawyer for the Banks...  But yet to you people, it's ok to bail out the Banks who started this mess, and not the workers who got caught in the mess because of the banks... You people are not forced to pay for a car from the big 3, but yet you are forced to pay for the bailout of Wall street and the Banks... And you are forced to pay for Government workers Health insurance even though you can not afford your own... Yes you pay for all Government workers things, all of it, and the Government workers make better money than the Auto workers, but the Auto Companies pay for their health insurance not you people...  A head Libraian on a military base makes $32.00 an hour, plus gets paid health insurance, and yes , you people pay for all this, and are forced to pay for all this from your taxes...

First paragraph of article.......'and are unconvinced failure would hurt the economy".  The Author is making a very bad assumption that those that are against the bailout are oblivious to the impact that a bankrupt big 3 will have on the economy.  There will be SIGNIFICANT impact but the government should not bail them out.  America is great not because we avoid painful situations; the right thing is often painful at first.....but like always, it will make us stronger.

To Salem 1692:  Airlines have gone bankrupt, but not all the airlines at once.  That's the difference.  Do you want to live in a country that can't manufacture it's own vehicles?

To disgusted indpendent:  UAW compensation is not an easy problem to solve.  GM actually pays its employees $0.28 less per hour than Toyota.  But when you add in current employee benefits and retiree benefits the total hourly wage is something like $22 more per hour.  Now maybe you can lower benefits for current employees.  But I don't believe taking retirement away from people that were promised it, and maybe gave up other opportunities for it, is a fair solutin.

paul,

pay the SEC fee and get gm's 2007 10-k. they as much as put in writing that the average cash wage - sans benefits - is close to $60/hr.

it was signed off on by outside counsel and the auditors. i doubt either would jeopardize their licenses or livelihood for something that would cost them a cool $1.5 million & 5 years time-for math errors. perjury is 5 times that.

moreover, if a single shareholder thought there was a single erroneous statement in that document, the tort lawyers would be having a field day. and the uaw is a shareholder, so they either find nothing wrong with that statement, or they are complicit in the perjury.

Those opposing the bailout of GM and Chrysler are seriously misguided and economically and financially naive. In a perfect world, we could painlessly tell GM and Chrysler in a situation like this: "Sorry, not this time." But we don't live in a perfect world, and the repercussions of their failure will be very severe.

Unfortunately, too many people are listening to hypocrite politicians such as Senators Richard Shelby of Alabama and Bob Corker of Tennesse. Both of their states have spent well over a billion dollars combined of state taxpayer money to subsidize foreign auto makers with low cost loans and tax breaks. These loudmouth hucksters don't give a hoot how much America suffers from a domestic auto failure. All they want to do is bust the UAW. They represent everything wrong with the Republican Party.

What's most telling is one of the biggest supporters of supporting big 3 is TOYOTA.  Their North American head of Toyota is on the record saying  that if one or all of the Big 3 fail, it will damage their business as well, since they rely on the same suppliers as the Big 3, and expect that many of them will go out of business, severly hampering Toyota's ability to get parts at reasonable costs.  Also, they see a massive jump in US unemployment if the Big 3 fail, so far fewer customers for their cars (Toyota's largest market is the US, larger even than their home market, Japan).  In fact, Toyota's position on what would happen if one or more of the Big 3 failed now is EXACTLY in line with what has been put forward by the Big 3.

The average union labor cost per hour for automakers is $73 ($152,000/yr w/no overtime). The average non-union automaker cost per hour is $44 ($92,000/yr). The average manufacturing job in the US costs $25 per hour ($52,000/yr). So the average UAW worker costs 3 times the US average. Therein lies the crux of the problem for the automakers. I believe that Reorganization to get their costs under control is the only answer. The union WILL NOT be realistic in their demands, so there would appear to be no viable other option. Having the Government give "loans" with conditions attached to force them to build cars that won't sell is ludicrous.

I agree let the big three go down with their unions and start over. It is their fault and not the peoples. They need to be lean and mean. Trim the fat. I don't totaly agree with bailing out the banks either, they also created their own problems . But their customers should have been smarter. They are the ones that need the help. It all comes down to greed. $$$$

Does the symbol $$ mean anything anymore?!?!?!....other than as stocking stuffers for corporations who cant even manage coming up with a truthful reason why they need all of Americans money?????

Other countries back their industries and the US never has.  Even the Japanese auto makers say that if nothing is done to stop the Big 3 from collapsing it will take the Japanese auto makers a good ten years to recover enough to make a noticeable profit from it and will damage their suppliers to the point of many may collapse as well.

The banks were insured for losses and now with the money they have gotten aren't passing it on and even the ones who have eligible people to lend to they aren't getting the loan applications as no one wants to take the chance that they may lose their job.

The real people who should have gotten the money are still wondering if they'll ever see the second stimulus check that Pelosi and Reid bragged would be approved by the end of Nov.  Where is that?

We can loan the automakers $14 Billion, fire the executives and find new ones that will work for free, force wage concessions, sell the jets and there will still not be millions of people lined up to buy cars.  Recessions are inevetable; they have been ever since when...1776?

We just refuse to believe that our economy can not grow every single month, quarter & year infinitely.  Then when it falls everyone is having a fit and acting completely surprised that anything like this could happen.  It must be Bush's fault;  recessions were invented on Jan 20,2000, right? 

We would be better off to use the $14 Billion to extend unemployment and re-training assistance and let the auto makers figure it out.   There is no way the Federal Government is going to stick a political hand into a business and restore it.

Yes, something needs to be done. But why won't the execs and UAW do their part? Why must it all land on the taxpayers?  I understand they are loans, but where is the guarantee they will be paid back if nothing really changes as the auto plants?

I believe most people realize that many more large......too big to fail corporations are going to go under in 2009. They also believe that the only way to stabilize our economy is to help the people .....not the corporations or institutionalized hedge funds (ponzi schemes) investment banks. It is the people....not the government.....not the stock holders....not foregin countries......that give these institutions life. Well the people can't help because the greedy...stupid....leaders of our institutions don't want to be reponsible so....bye bye.....the people will recover....We can suffer with a lack of jobs in the short run or suffer trying to support fraud with our treasury plus infaltion and higher taxes. Our corporate society needs to end...actually I am thrilled about it....now it is time to listen to the people and let us solve our problems and develop new industries that are much better then the crap wall street produces.

Ok, I'm getting a little tired of the hammering that the big 3 are getting regarding their quality. I have a 2004 Ram 1500 Dodge pickup that has given us NO problems. My dad has a 2003 Dodge Durango that has given him NO problems. My mother in law has a Honda Odyssey that has door problems, lighting problems, cruise problems. It isn't as old as the Dodges.

Quality can be found anywhere, so can lack of quality. Anyone remember Harley-Davidson? In the 70's and 80's, you couldn't GIVE them away, they were so poorly made. Today, there's a waiting list for them.

The fact is, you get what you're looking for. I'll take my Dodge over your imports any day.

The majority was against the bank bailout too, and now they are saying we would have had the great depression without.  We may anyhow it looks like since people are losing their jobs either way.  Does anyone realize that if the big three go down they will take several companies and jobs with them?  They can walk away from their debt, pensions (could be passed on to us), healthcare expenses that they have already collected the money but will not be paying, and every business dependant upon them to keep their doors open.  If you or I go down, they will hunt us down for our last dime.  But big business will stick it too us if they go down, as well as cost more jobs.  Our problems here is we can not compete because upper management and owners expect more money than they do in China or Korea or Japan.  Healthcare is not an issue for our competitors and their government has been bailing them out to keep them competitive for years.  We can not compete if others are allowed to cheat.  I do agree that management pushed their companies down the tubes by continuing to build SUV's and unreliable cars as a whole.  That can not be blamed on the guy turning the wrench, that is engineering, R&D and the corporate culture as to what they will invest in.  Our best bet is to break out our big businesses into smaller ones so we don't have to pay huge salaries to CEO"s upper management, and no stockholders to cut into the pie either.  People use to invest, there is so much money invested now that they expect a huge payback for doing nothing, that simply does not work in our nation, and never has.  We are about hard working people, not about INVESTORS.. or hedgers.. geesh.  Take the healthcare and pensions off the backs of our companies, put our tax dollars into investing in smaller companies that keep their jobs here and I think we would be much better off.  For now, the banks got the dough and now we are told there are no real TEETH in paulsens CEO salary cap.. gee what a surprise.  Unions can be bad or good, they had some real loser ideas that is for sure.  But big business has never looked out for us at all.  Look at how they are running for the border to get cheaper labor and could care less who buys their products, the stock holders dont care if we have jobs who who buys the stuff, as long as they have profits some how.. They are unAmerican....  We need unions.. At least unions of people joining together saying enough is enough.   Take the bank bailout money, bail out GM since the banks think they don't have to watch the salaries of CEO's.. and lets all send a email to our congressmen and women that we want fair trade for our country for once and to heck with the stock holders.. wall street is corrupt I think, and I think they are to blame.

Honda and Toyota are more expensive than our cars because they have better fuel effeciency and are rated better in over all reliablity.  A test of one car is not a fair comparison.  But I do applaude you for owning American cars, but many are also built in Mexico now.  It seems the big three have huge issues with union wages that are really .28 cents less than what Toyota and Honda pay.  The problem is that Japan backs her car companies and she backs their healthcare and pensions.  We expect our companies to pay for theirs but do not offer them an fair trade concessions for that fact.  We also pay our CEO's a great deal more, and our stock holders expect a lot more.  The big three have chosen to waste gobs of money on gas guzzlers instead of new R&D and wasted the profits instead of retooling.  Yet, I support helping them because a depression would be worse.  But I think we need to make sure we have our companies have the same fair shake in the world of trade as other nations do.  And we need to review who is voting who a raise in big business.  Perhaps cutting our auto mfg up into more companies would cut the overhead a bit because in smaller businesses those at the top expect to be paid less.

I am concerned that any bailout money will simply vanish into thin air (CEO Swiss bank accounts, that is) and that the average American worker will not benefit at all, but will have to pay for it.

I am also concerned that we are removing all accountability from anyone.

I understand why so many people are against this bailout - however, I really do feel that the entire economy will be devastatingly affected if we don't give these companies one more chance to "get it right".  We certainly don't make or produce much in this country anymore.  At least we do have 3 companies that are "American!"  If they fail, there will be more than just union workers without jobs.  Suppliers, autodealerships, and whole communities will be affected.  There will be towns that literally become ghost towns.  Also the welfare and unemployment rolls will be enormous.  Home foreclosures will more than double and that's just the tip of the iceberg.  If one goes down, it could take all 3 with it.  Plus it will also affect the ability of the foreign autos made in this country to keep up their production.  Many of them use some of the same suppliers who will be shutting their doors.  Think long and hard on this before you believe that this country shouldn't at least give them one more chance.  If we can get through the next year and show some improvement in the economy, then maybe all of us can survive!!!

grt rid of the unions so any can work,at 25 to 30 dollars an hor that is the unions falt they the unions strike for more money and i am looking for work at 10 per hour.make it a right to work state for all to apply.

Yup, people are the ones who need the help.  Stopping the bailout now that the financial institutions and banks have gotten their money is not the right thing to do. They (and the do-nothing Congress) are the ones who started all of this. 

Agreed that the US automakers need reform, but now is not the time.  If they don't get "bailed out", millions (?) will lose their jobs.  Later reformation will only pare down the total number of jobs, not all. 

Seems to me that if it's OK to bail out the banks without restricitions, seems only fair they give the bridge loan or whatever it wil be called to the automakers, so their tax base isn't decimated "for the good of the country".

Let everything fail... banks, wall street, and the whole gig.  We can restructure the country with our guns... just like what made this country great at one time.  This country is a joke now.  PS:  republicans are bad eating but they work good to feed the hogs.  Senators from Alabama make them puke though, so just run those throught the tree chipper and scatter the remains on the road... you don't want to keep them around, they'll drain yopur resources.   And as far as vic-775799 goes, the auto industry is hiring at 14 dollars an hour, but you need an education... high school diploma works.

wilfred,

the southern states only did what all state and/or local governments do when a big-ticket employer is looking to site a facility - the competed with other locations with tried and true incentives. in this case, the southern states won. would you be complaining if the plants were in michigan or ohio?  i think not.

How can they say most oppose it when they only polled 1000 people. These polls are full of crap. i bet if you went to michigan youd find the poll going the other way. They gave the financial industry 700 billion dollars and what has trhat accomplished? Helping ssave 1 million jobs is worth the price for giving the Big 3 the money

How can they say that most people oppose it when they only poll 1000 people? I bet if you went to Michigan youd get a different polling. The congress gave the financial industry 700 billion to play with and then congress balks at 25-40 billion? Thats a load of crap. They are also blaming the unions for the poor management decisions. Since when do workers decide business practices? UAW workers make an average of 28 an hour. Workers that started last year start at 14. Just think how many people work for the automakers and the suppliers. ! to 3 million workers would be affected, but it seems that republicans have unions takedown in thier minds once again. Unions only make up 10% of the workforce today and without unions you would have a 40 hour week or a 8 hour day.

People people people, come on! Does anyone remember worldcom? 107 BILIION dollar bankruptcy - no one gave us a bailout and me and most of my friends lost everything - the main thing was it bounced back and evened out - this is EXACTLY what needs to happen to the BIG 3! Did it hurt for the short term absolutely - but now it's better and Bernie Ebbers and his gang are in jail - Kenneth Lay at Enron died going to jail - yet we see no one taking responsibility for their companies - hand outs hand outs - so socialist not capitalist

They should be forced to re-structure just like the airlines. The Unions are the worst - the laws are so strict nowadays are Unions really needed? When you pay people out of market you will see failure - Toyota must be doing something right they pay their employees half of what big 3.....hmmm 43hr X 2080 (the amount of hours 40 hr work week in a year) = 89,440 - not a shabby salary for toyota employees (and this doesn't include overtime) - now lets look at GM $78hrX2080 = $162,240 a year not including OT - HMMMMM see the difference

Now ona similiar note, the unions have been hitting healthcare and everyone screams healthcare is sooo high - HMMM - lets think any connection??

Give me a break if we want hand outs - give it back to the tax payer to pay off their debts and loans then the companies still survive - but that just seems to "irresponsible??"  It's ridiculous that our national leaders are not listening to - what did the poll say? 73% of America is not for this bail out - I say write your senators and say NO!

By doing this, companies now have a kind of false sense of security because they know the Gov. will just "bail" them out. Us tax payers. These corporations need to do some major house cleaning with the big cats. Redicoulous salaries for redicoulous results. GRRRR.

chris,

1000 people is approx. the same sample used for most polls, including election polls.